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FJ-

Are your shots rapid fire or do you pause to re-aim?

Do you holster between shots and quick draw?

The onesies-twosies that are way off the center--what happens there? Are those the double-actions or first rounds, or just the occasional wild shots?

(Not criticising, just trying to figure out what I'm looking at).

-Ron

I don't rapid fire, but, with the guns other than the .45, I just squeexed the trigger as soon as the sights lined up and didn't take excessive time to aim. The way off center shots on the Walthers when held with two hands were the double action shots.

Six inches off or not, with the .45 it would still be a dead perp.

Good shooting! What's the reason you're not in the military?

I often wish I could get mugged. I don't carry a firearm myself, but I used to occassionally enjoy the feel of bone against my fist.

You handgun guys are all wrong. Shotguns, baby, shotguns. If someone breaks through my front door, I am not worrying about my grouping...I am blowing the bastard right back out, and the dogs get to eat "tartare".

Not bad, even with the occassional flier. Just think, only 89 more days until the AWB sunsets and then you can buy all the hi-cap mags you want. Woo-Hoo!

Brass

I like the concept of the backpocket cookie, it does make carrying very convenient. However, when carrying in big urban environments (best place to get mugged)...what about pickpockets? It doesn't look like it would go well in the front pocket. Or do you have to just be really careful and keep your hand on you a$$ in crowds?

Actually, they make a front pocket version, though the backpocket version does fit in the front pocket, and the piece used to make wallet outline can work as a shield allowing me to put things like keys in the same pocket and not have them rub up against the gun.

Frank,

Notice the difference between your .45 targets and your Kel-tec/PPKs/P99 targets. Your shots are going low with the .45. Classic shot anticipation a/k/a "flinching" due to recoil.

I had an instructor once ask me, "Why are your shots going low?" I responded that I though my (Glock 22) sights were off. He then took my gun (after asking), and drilled one shot, dead center on the target. He then said, "Those sights are perfect," put the gun back in my holster, and turned to the next student. Talk about embarassing!

And as said above, watch the front sight. Remember the "three secrets," sight alignment, sight picture, trigger control. And press the trigger, don't squeeze. The shot should surprise you. Do slow fire, before rapid fire. Don't reinforce bad habits.

Highly consider getting training. It's not admitting weakness. You didn't teach *yourself* Aikido, did you?

May I suggest: http://www.frontsight.com/FirearmsTraining/

Of course, there are other schools . . .

I meant to add:

(lecture mode *off*)

And remember the purpose of a handgun. It's so you can fight your way to your shotgun! (if one's nearby that is . . .)

--sam

I think the sights were throwing me off just because I usually do much better, but I would like some real training.

Not bad, all considered.

A friend of mine carries the Kel-Tec as a backup, and calls it "the weapon of choice for a gunfight in a phone booth"...

why don't you use Rachel Lucas' Michael Moore Cannes Film Festival targets? I bet that'd improve your aim loads...

try this:

http://www.rachellucas.com/archives/000868.html#000868

I think the Kel-Tec is more accurate than the crude sights it comes with. I mainly shot from instinct with it.

I bet your aim is the same with the urinal.

Go for the CW permit - it does wonders for your confidence.

I am a police officer that works on a street narcotics team in a large city in Texas. I am not allowed to tell you which one since it is against policy and I am writing this to you on a city computer.
We had some down time today, and my Sgt and some of my teammates took a look at your targets. I must tell you that my supervisor had some less than constructive criticism for you.

I used to carry a .40 cal Walther P99 as my primary duty weapon. Even for law enforcement, the biggest mag you can get is only twelve rounds. FYI both myself and a coworker have stopped carrying the P99 bcuz of problems with it. The hilt of my Walther literaly broke in half when I dropped it while trying to hit a suspect over the head with it. Long story.
Walther sent me a new gun to replace it but I still won't carry it on the street. My partner bought a Smith P99 and his slide did not seat all the way and the gun basically cracked in his hand the first time he shot it. I would advise you to get a new gun... even though the Walther is the smoothest shooting gun I have ever fired.

As far as your shooting goes... it looks like on the .45 targets you are anticipating recoil. I suspect that you are dipping the nose of the weapon at the last second as you squeeze the trigger, in anticipation of the coming jolt from the recoil.

Your PPK and kel tek targets are much better, probably due to the smaller calibre of the weapon and reduced recoil.

I don't know what to tell you about the P99. I can't offer anything constructive, but this is what my Sgt says: "You suck and you need to practice a whole bunch."

The two most important things to remember are sight alighnment and

oops... accidently hit the "POST" button.

Anyway sight alignment and trigger control. Focus on the front sight and slowly squeeze the trigger. You just need to practice.
Sorry the post was so long... hope I helped.

I needed that advice too, cause my .45 shots are doing the same thing. Funny, I didn't think I was anticipating recoil. Anyway, low and left.

Frank, do you know if your .45 shots are starting high and moving low/left, or the other way around?

i forgot what the pictures looked like when i read the last line. "i can't wait to get mugged!"

yer funny.

Frank,

I concur that you may be flinching with the .45. One way to confirm this is to have a couple of dummy rounds inserted into a magazine by a friend such that you won't know where in the string they lie.

If you drop the muzzle on pressing the trigger, you're flinching.

Dry firing practice should help cure this. You should be dry firing routinely, at this stage preferably a hundred times or more for each live round. Before starting and every time you pick up your pistol, rack the slide and verify it is unloaded at least five times before proceeding. Burn this habit deeply into your brain. Be certain the ammo and magazines are in the other room where the Ammo Fairy can't come by and load your pistol when you're not looking. Even then, observe Cooper's Four Rules and don't cover anything with the muzzle you don't mind perforating. (Mentally, your pistol should never be "unloaded.")

An old trick to remedy flinching is to balance a quarter on the top of the slide just forward of the rear sight. Taking your time, squeeze only when the sights are aligned on target, holding otherwise. NEVER try to "catch" your target with the sights. When the hammer drops, not only should the "break" be a surprise, but the quarter should stay put.

As you progress, you'll find that you can markedly compress the interval required for a "surprise break." In time, it will be possible to draw, obtain a "flash" sight picture and a surprise break in substantially less than one second, especially with your youthful reflexes.

Bastard.

Frank, there's nothing better than busting caps, is there? Man I love that smell!

Moriarty's advice is dead on. I used to dry snap about 100 times a night... aimed at a lightswitch or some dot on the wall. Again, Colonel Jeff's Four Rules are awlays in effect. I finally got rid of my flinching. That thing with the quarter is a good idea.

BOOM BOOM! *Klink klink klink*

Slab out

Frank,
Previous posts have correctly identified your problem - anticipation of recoil. For a right handed shooter this will always go low and right. The shooter tightens his / her grip, and too a lesser degree "pushes" the handgun in anticipation of it firing(hold your pistol in a shooting position and tighten your grip - watch what happens to the muzzle). I am an NRA instructor and have taught a lot of people how to shoot, mostly beginners, I have used the dummy round trick resulting in some of them falling over - so don't feel to bad about you shooting- you didn't fallover did you?.

Fixes - some already noted, dummy round will only identify the problem, dry firing is the best way to start(some pistols will need snap caps). Slow everything down to the point that you are putting pressure on the trigger without any noticable movement of your finger. The hammer will fall without your knowledge. As you develop you can increase the speed at which you move the trigger.

If your hammer has a whole in it you can tie a string to it, throw it over your shoulder and tie it to you belt. This allows you to cock the gun without disturbing your grip or hold on the weapon (takes some adjusting). Essentially allowing you to dry rapid fire. Dry fire often and to the point that you can move the trigger rapidly but smoothly for defensive, rapid shooting. In slow fire you can squeeze, or put pressure on the trigger in slow incremental steps -rapid fire requires a smooth steady stoke to be effective.

The next time you go to the range practice slow fire only until you can keep it all in the black. Put pressure on the trigger as long as your sights are aligned, if they stray, hold what you have on the trigger, realign the sites and continue your trigger stroke. Keep practicing until you can do all things correctly and quickly.

Last, don't say things like "can't wait to get mugged." It would surely come up in court later. Enroll in a Leather Force Institute course. They will teach you how to shoot and not go to jail / loose a lawsuit. Subscribe to Combat Handguns.

Wrong. I messed up the sights with that paint crap. That's the only explanation.

Anticipating recoil... come on...

Sure, Frnak, the paint did it. Now hurry up and send the check for that Colorado beachfront property.
Dryfire with that coin sitting on to of your shootin' iron and get you one of those squeeze grip springy things. Develope a grip that can crush granite. Now, sight the gun on a target, squeeze that grip until the sights start shaking, let off until they steady up, that's how hard to hold 'er. As you work with the spring grip thing, you'll get stronger and steadier.
Until you spend some time dryfiring you can save a helluva lot of money on range fees and ammo. Just stand out in the parking lot and yell 'BANG!' at the top of your lungs.
Back when I shot on my department's team we'd take turns coaching each other on the practice range, it's amazing how easily it is to let bad habits sneak into your routine. My competition career is over now but I still take turns with my shootin' buds coaching each other. After all, I'm just a beginner, I've only been shooting and handloading for forty-five years now.

Finally, I got my holster from Graham's Leather, the backpocket cookie for my Kel-Tec. Now, anytime I want to carry I can just put this in my backpocket. I can't wait until I get mugged!

uh, frank, if you do get mugged and if you end up shooting the mugger, you'd better hope to God the prosecutor and/or the mugger (or mugger's estate) doesn't see you saying this. we all know you're just joking around, but a prosecutor who's looking for a conviction will think, "ah-ha! this cowboy was looking to shoot up somebody! i'm gonna get me a pay raise!!!" same with some slimy personal injury lawyer "this guy made my client try to mug him, just so he could shoot holes in my client! now award me, i mean my client, $800,000,000"

for the record, you might want to put a foot note explaining for such idiots that it really is a joke and explaining what your personal policies are concerning self defense. just some friendly advice

a few low light suggestions, but i didn't read all the comments, so forgive me if this has been mentioned before.

a few cheap military tricks at nightfire...first, put chemstick goo on your sights (this is one of the primary things that pisses me off about grabanarab prison reporting, chemstick goo WILL NOT hurt you). that'll make them easier to see.

second and more importantly, work on your natural point of aim. practice bringing the weapon up with your eyes closed until you're on target. that helps a ton with nightfire, since you can't see the sights. until you can accurately point a weapon without sighting, your skills at shooting in the dark won't be too great.

and if you still can't hit, become an officer and have the spec beside you shoot your targets. :)

Light Sticks - yes the "poured Phosporic liquid on the detainees" statements were a bit much. The liquid in a chem-light is non-toxic. I read once that some people were using them to spice up their sex life - so, what colors would make the best contrast? Or for you military types, get an infrared stick and a set of night vision goggles,-hmmmm?

Frank, I'm very much a newbie, so I have nothing to contribute re: improving your groups. Sounds like you're getting good advice from other folks.

But from reading your archives, you seem to experience a fair amount of jams from some of your guns -- though not your 1911 (which is great, since I gather that's your primary defense gun).

I'm just curious: Have you thought about benching that Kel-Tec and replacing it with a compact revolver? The little K-Ts are amazingly slim and handy (I looked one over at the gun store recently), so I can see why so many people buy them, but even as a novice, I've read an awful lot of anecdotes about them jamming.

In contrast, a relative of mine has a little S&W Airweight 642 that you can slip in your pants pocket and scarcely know it's there. It weighs 15 oz unloaded. She and I have put about 500 rounds through that wheelgun with absolutely no misfires or hiccups of any kind. Seems like that is how a carry gun should behave. I'd take 5 firmly reliable rounds of .38 spl +P over 6 or 7 rounds, maybe, of .380 from the Kel-Tec.

Compared with your semi-autos, do you have many FTFs with your Colt .44 Anaconda revolver?

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