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April 24, 2007
Pop-Pop
Posted by Cadet Happy at 11:20 AM | View blog reactions | Comments (63)

I'm going to be getting a CCW permit (one of the few liberties secure in Minnesota), and I'm looking for suggestions concerning the type of weapon I should try out/purchase. I think I would prefer an ankle holster. I would prefer something discrete, though capable of taking down a reasonably motivated assailant with one or two shots. It would be nice if it also was a decent target practice weapon. I would not anticipate any need to quickly load and re-load. I would like a rock solid safety mechanism, though not too difficult to disengage when needed. What is your opinion?

ungun.JPG

Rating: 1.5/5 (3 votes cast)

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63 Responses To "Pop-Pop"

How about an .88 Magnum?

Danny Vermin: I got something to stop him.
Dutch: They made it for him special. It's an eighty-eight Magnum.
Danny Vermin: It shoots through schools.

Name that movie!

#1 - Posted by: BubbaB on April 24, 2007 12:03 PM

Johnny Dangerously?

#2 - Posted by: cirby on April 24, 2007 12:12 PM

I'd give serious thought to that ankle holster. That's a long way from your hand in an emergency. Myself, I like a high-ride paddle holster because it lets me carry a pretty hefty weapon (Sig P220) and conceals well under a light jacket or even an open loose fitting shirt. (I like Hawian prints :)

As for the gun itself...if I wanted to be confident in my ability to take down a motivated aggresor quickly I wouldn't want anything lighter than a .40SW in a semi-automatic or .357 in a revolver. However, you can drop a man with one shot from a .22 if you put it in the right place and a lot of cops still carry 9mm. What it comes down to is getting a caliber you are comfortable shooting and that you can afford to shoot a lot of because whatever you get you are going to want to take it to the range for practice on a regular basis.

As for Brand. I really, really, really like my Sig. It's a little on the large size for concealed carry but the holster I use does a pretty good job.

Hope that was helpful and good luck with your choice! Shopping for a new gun is always fun.

#3 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 12:13 PM

hahaha, well, my personal favorite is a taurus raging bull, but theres also a taurus tracker, colt anaconda, hell, any revolver, but im telling you, that bull has some stopping power ;) its muzzle flash is over a foot long! NOTHING is moving after a hit from that baby (hell you dont even have to hit them, take them out by shooting near them, or even just in the air, if just pulling out the gun doesnt do it; but then what fun can you have if they give up?) there is also just somthing simple and good, like a glock 9, i like those, there are a ton of good weapons, but if you want it on hand, then a revolver is great (now, for in your car.....)

#4 - Posted by: Senpai on April 24, 2007 12:20 PM

my only concern with a waist holster, is that I wear a tucked in dress shirt, and typically don't wear a suit coat in my office (where I spend most of my time) -- when i do wear my suit coat, i'm going to court, and federal marshal's tend to frown on people bringing loaded guns into court -- i want it to be 100% concealed -- though your point concerning the ankle holster is well taken -- you can't plausibly reach for your ankles to "get your wallet" or whatever, and that would expose you to a kick to the face even if you could plausibly do it

lol -- "shoots through schools"

#5 - Posted by: cadet on April 24, 2007 12:36 PM

You'll shoot your eye out, kid.

#6 - Posted by: RightWingDuck on April 24, 2007 12:38 PM

(just for giggles)
Although a gun supporter, in your neck of the country I might want to go for a "Lightsaber". They're discrete, but lethal and leave nothing to trace back to you.

A secondary benefit is since few there have ever seen any of the movies (especially the libs who foam at the mouth whenever guns, war, and self determination are mentioned) they won't have a clue what they're looking for.

Of course you'd have to find a Jedi master to teach you but that shouldn't be too hard, right.

#7 - Posted by: seanmahair on April 24, 2007 12:47 PM

Something easly concealed? I'd recommend the Kel-Tec P3AT or P32. Granted it is not .45 ACP, but if you are more likely to carry it then it is better than a 1911 at home. I tried to conceal carry a Glock 27, the subcompact .40, but the east of the my Kel-Tec P32 is great, it is light and small enough to fit in your pocket. There will be others who say nah, I want something more powerful. Go for it. I don't need to engage a bad guy at 20-30 yds. My Kel-Tec is my last ditch defensive weapon, not a sniper rifle.

#8 - Posted by: Duncan Avatar on April 24, 2007 12:48 PM

Check these out. It'll give you an idea of some other options. You quite correct in taking into account your normal attire when selecting a holster.

SKYOPS HOLSTER
PUSH UP INSIDE THE PANT HOLSTER
FRONT POCKET HORSEHIDE HOLSTER

The One I Use

#9 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 12:50 PM

What Duncan said.

My local Chief of police carries a Kel-Tec Ps2 as his backup weapon and he swears by it.

#10 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 12:53 PM

PIMF

Meh... P32

#11 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 12:54 PM

I have Pop-Pop in the attic.
What? The mere fact that you call making love "pop pop" tells me you're not ready.

#12 - Posted by: Ian on April 24, 2007 01:01 PM

Politics aside, HK and Glock make some damn good handguns. A 9mm is really all you need for close quarters protection, with a .45 for that extra "Uumph."

or if you're feeling saucy, the Desert Eagle can be the key to happiness.

#13 - Posted by: Ringmaster on April 24, 2007 01:03 PM

AK-47

#14 - Posted by: Emiliano on April 24, 2007 01:07 PM

I personally own a Glock 23C that I love. However, for your needs, I'd suggest a Glock 36. Due to it's size it only carries 6 rounds, but it's a .45. I would have expected it to have a lot of recoil, but was shocked when it was almost easier on my hand than my Glock 23.

#15 - Posted by: FlaK on April 24, 2007 01:20 PM

How about a "Bang-Bang - the sweetest little automatic"?

#16 - Posted by: bunkerboy on April 24, 2007 01:58 PM

I'm partial to my Colt 1911.

#17 - Posted by: hjmick on April 24, 2007 01:58 PM

Why conceal? I think we should get CW. Then you could put it on your hip.

#18 - Posted by: Mekan on April 24, 2007 02:11 PM

Why conceal? I think we should get CW. Then you could put it on your hip.
Depending on where you live, you may already have that right. See map at the link.

opencarry.org

#19 - Posted by: on April 24, 2007 02:40 PM

Carry a large caliber, large-frame gun. That way you'll have stopping power without the recoil of a compact. I'd suggest a Springfield XD or a Glock. IF you've got lots of money because Frank pays you too much, get a HK or a Sig. Once you've found a gun you're comfortable (and good) with, match a holster to your needs. Do this through experimentation. You'll likely end up with several, each serving a different purpose.

Oh, and yeehaw.

#20 - Posted by: HKpistole on April 24, 2007 02:41 PM

Here's a sweet little number...(.45acp)

http://www.detonicsusa.com/combatmaster.html

...one of my favs

#21 - Posted by: everydayjoe on April 24, 2007 02:42 PM

I recommend the Magnum P.I.

#22 - Posted by: spacemonkey on April 24, 2007 02:44 PM

The problem with Glocks and Sigs would be your desire for a safety.

I have an Sig Pro SP 2340 and I love it, but it's funny, my Springfield 1911 milspec with 5" barrel is a leetle beet smaller.

Check out a 1911 with a 5" barrel. It has a rock solid safety that's very easy to use (the thumb on your shooting hand works it and you can train yourself to automatically release it upon drawing the weapon), it's .45ACP, one of the most manly and American of rounds, it's a decent target pistol and, IT'S A 1911!!!!!!

While an ankle holster looks cool on TV, you need a really small gun (.25 automatic or the 32 mentioned above) or it's very obvious.
Your clothing should decide your holster.

Me? My carry piece is a .500 Smith & Wesson. I carry it in a baldric.

#23 - Posted by: Veeshir on April 24, 2007 02:50 PM

I would carry nothing smaller than a .40 SW, and I would recommend to carry a .45 acp. Shot placement in a high stress situation will almost always be less than perfect, and larger calibers make up for it somewhat.

I personally recommend a non-"custom target" 1911, or a HK USP .45. Virtually 100% of USPs fire right out of the box, not something that can be said of all gun manufacturers.

Buy a sturdy gun belt, and a quality IWB holster (Versa Max or a C-Tac).

Buy reasonably heavy ammunition with a quality bullet known to expand through clothing. In .40, I would go with a 180 gr Ranger-T, Gold Dot, or Federal HST. The same goes for 230 gr .45 acp.

#24 - Posted by: Chase on April 24, 2007 03:14 PM

The small Kel-Tec autos are ideal. Easy to carry since they're small and compact. Fun to shoot and, so far, mine have been totally reliable. A .380 won't shoot through a school but, no mugger ever said "What is that, a .22? Go ahead and shoot me all you want while you give me your wallet." Face it...a gun is trump. BTW, there is a funny post-shooting questionaire at The Kel-Tec Owners Group (KTOG) web site.

#25 - Posted by: Texas Warhead on April 24, 2007 03:15 PM

Great thing about the Great State of New Mexico. Open carry, no permit required. For concealed, I use a .40 if in the small of my back or if I'm using my shoulder holster I carry my .380 as it conceals better than the .40 under a coat.

#26 - Posted by: allthatsright on April 24, 2007 03:18 PM

I would carry nothing smaller than a .40 SW, and I would recommend to carry a .45 acp. Shot placement in a high stress situation will almost always be less than perfect, and larger calibers make up for it somewhat.

I personally recommend a non-"custom target" 1911, or a HK USP .45. Virtually 100% of USPs fire right out of the box, not something that can be said of all gun manufacturers.

Buy a sturdy gun belt, and a quality IWB holster (Versa Max or a C-Tac).

Buy reasonably heavy ammunition with a quality bullet known to expand through clothing. In .40, I would go with a 180 gr Ranger-T, Gold Dot, or Federal HST. The same goes for 230 gr .45 acp.

#27 - Posted by: Chase on April 24, 2007 03:25 PM

Seeing as it's MN, I'd go with a Glock 27/Blackhawk CQC for the 3/4 of the year when a jacket/outer shirt is necessary and a Kel-Tec PF-9 (.32 is just not enough to deal with the perp ramped up on street-flavor-of-the-week in my book)/Galco front pocket protector for the warmer months. Also, stock up on ammo at your local gun show once or twice a year to keep costs down.

#28 - Posted by: beemereater on April 24, 2007 03:30 PM

Holy Bananas, Batman, I double posted.

Poo

#29 - Posted by: Chase on April 24, 2007 03:32 PM

"I recommend the Magnum P.I."
Posted by: spacemonkey on April 24, 2007 02:44 PM

It could break the skin. Yeah really.

#30 - Posted by: Dodsfall on April 24, 2007 03:44 PM

Look up the P229R 'Crimson Trace' here:
www.sigarms.com

It's compact & merely weighs 31.1 ounces with the clip.

Of course, if I could carry anything for defense (Heh.), I go with an HK MP7A1 PDW, but people in general & law enforcement in particular tend to freak out at the sight of a SMG.

#31 - Posted by: AlanABQ on April 24, 2007 03:46 PM

This is what I recommend:

http://www.barrettrifles.com/rifle_82.aspx

It's difficult to keep it "concealed," but it comes in handy when you have to defend yourself from someone who is a mile and a half away.

#32 - Posted by: Beo on April 24, 2007 03:54 PM

I recommend the Colt 1911 with the five inch barrel. Good sturdy gun, lotsa stopping power and easilly enough concealed. And, to hammer the point home like many others, forget the damn ankle holster.

#33 - Posted by: Trigger on April 24, 2007 04:14 PM

I prefer a S&W compact 9mm with either JHP or frangibles. The compact is very concealable and just a wonderful gun to shoot. The talon-style JHP will stop any non-vest wearing goofball and are available to the public. A friend got me some wonderful wadcutter frangibles - they are pressed wire and have almost no penetration for hard objects (like sheetrock walls). Delivers 90+% of energy in the first three inches of soft target (skin). Blew a watermelon apart like a 1/4 stick of dynamite, really cool.
SGT Dave

#34 - Posted by: SGT Dave on April 24, 2007 04:34 PM

I recommend a 22mm automatic.

#35 - Posted by: Brian Ross on April 24, 2007 04:34 PM

Hey, thanks to all you guys plugging the HK USP.
This is why I come here, cause you peeps be smart.

I love you all.

#36 - Posted by: HKpistole on April 24, 2007 04:43 PM

In terms of concealable weapons, I currently own a Taurus 85 (.38spl), Glock 26(9mm), and a 1908 Vest Pocket (.25ACP).

There are two approaches to what a safety does: one addresses what happens if you pull the trigger accidentally; the other what happens if you drop the gun.

Any revolver suitable for concealed carry won't have a safety switch, but more recent ones have a device to disconnect the hammer in case of a drop.

A Glock has no external safeties, but has three separate internal safety devices that give you as close to an iron-clad guarantee you can get that the gun won't go off in the case of it being dropped or some other physical trauma.

The Glock was my very first handgun, and I found it very easy to load, unload, disassemble, clean, and fire. I find it less tedious than a revolver to clean, and it is the quickest, easiest autoloader I have when it comes to field stripping. The Glock also resists my sweatiness very well due to its polymer frame and tenifer treated metal bits. It has a reputation for being able to stand all kinds of abuse, and is a good, affordable all rounder gun.

I got a Blackhawk CQC Holster because I'm allergic to most leathers and I think Carbon Fiber is waay cool. The CQC locks the gun into the holster and you have to depress a release with your index finger to get the gun out. I really, really like that feature. It is safer than a friction-hold holster, and quicker than a thumb-break. When you draw, pressing the release guarantees that your finger is away from the trigger, and in my opinion, that is a key consideration for any holster you consider. In my estimation, that more than makes up for the Glock not having an external safety.

One brand of concealed holster I'd like to look into more, but haven't had the chance to yet is the Thunderwear holster. It seems to combine the best of deep concealment and rapid access in a single package. I can't wear my CQC without some sort of jacket on; Thunderwear, if the hype is true, I can wear just about anywhere.

I use 9mm, and most folks don't think it's enough, but that kid at VT was able to do a lot of damage with 9mm. Most of the comparisons are in terms of FMJ ammunition. Switching to even the cheapest Jacketed Hollowpoints in 9mm brings you more stopping power than just about any caliber in Full Metal Jacket. I can get Remington UMC Jacketed Hollow Points for a very nice price at Wal-Mart.

You can actually see for yourself how much a bullet can "mushroom" in a very cheap and easy way by stapling a few phone books together (or a stack of newspapers, etc.) and shooting at them. Explore different types of ammo for yourself. Hint: the more mushroom the better.

Remember, if you're going to do concealed carry, the holster is as important as the gun.

#37 - Posted by: anonymous on April 24, 2007 05:04 PM

I'll agree with anon on the "safety" issue. My Sig has no external, user operated, safety.

Yet is as safe as any double-action revolver with the hammer down.

All the saftey stuff is internal and requires that the trigger be pulled for the gun to go bang. I own a Colt .357 Mag revolver that dates from the late 70's, early '80's that has a similar "trigger must be pulled" system in place.

Bottom line is, with the Sig, you pull the trigger it goes bang. Otherwise....no bang. Drop it, hit the hammer with a hammer, whatever, no bang. I'd advise you to visit the Sig and Glock websites and familerise yourself with the safty mechinisms before you pass judgement.

Another personal opinion: I don't like Glocks for one reason and one reason only...They don't have an external hammer. That is purely a personal thing and I fully understand why LEO types like them. They weigh less. For a LEO type who's already carrying umpteen pounds of gear weight matters. It might matter to you, too.

#38 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 06:11 PM

Kalashnikov.

#39 - Posted by: Muslihoon on April 24, 2007 06:39 PM

The tricky part is the concealment! I use a Bagmaster Belt Pistol Pack (http://www.bagmaster.com/website/cart/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=56&cat=Fanny+and+Belt+Packs). It's NOT a fanny pack, but it lets me conceal a gun in a cotton (or leather) zippered case. It lets you draw vertically instead of horizontally as in fanny packs. It clips to your belt. The only setting where I can't use it is when I need to wear a suit jacket -- the profile is too thick, it makes me look as if I have a horrible growth on my hip.


Since most of us have little natural padding at the ankle, I found an ankle holster downright painful after a few hours.


I suppose an attache case holster makes sense for some people, but I don't want to be separated from my gun in public. It's my gun, I'm responsible for it, and as long as it's on my hip I'm not worried about a friend's six-year-old getting into it.

#40 - Posted by: Anthony Trauring on April 24, 2007 07:05 PM

I too am getting a CCW permit sometime in the future in MN and I have been told that this is a good gun.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14761&langId=-1&isFirearm=Y

#41 - Posted by: Bwee on April 24, 2007 07:57 PM

Bwee's link

Good Gun.

#42 - Posted by: Fuloydo on April 24, 2007 08:37 PM

Look at the Kimber Ultra-Carry. It's a small M1911 style in .45ACP. Small enough that my very tiny Ex-GF (5'2", 100lbs) carried it daily.

And 2 or 3 45's with 230 gr Hydra-Shoks will definitely put a dent in anyone's day.

Absolutely reliable, excellent safety, accurate...

You can't ask for more.

I carry a Kimber Pro-Carry m'self (A little larger than the Ultra-Carry) and have had very good results with it.

Orion

#43 - Posted by: Orion on April 24, 2007 11:47 PM

I'd recommend a Kahr brand. I carry a Keltec P3AT daily because it's small enough to fit in my pocket. A Pager Pal/Cell phone Pal holster will allow you to carry a Kahr readily concealed with no problem. Kahr's don't have external safeties, but like a Glock they are VERY safe. They are also thinner and easier to conceal than any Glock. A CW9 or CW40 are both reasonably priced. Spare mags are a bit pricy, but not bad from Cheaper Than Dirt.

#44 - Posted by: FrmrArtyOffcr on April 25, 2007 01:10 AM

My current list of handguns includes a 357, a 45, 3 nine mm, 3 380 acps, a 40 S&W, a few 22s and a 44 mag. I love Arizona. My suggestion would be to go hit a range and rent a few guns and see what you are most comfortable shooting. It makes no sense to spend $500+ for a handgun that you are so uncomfortable shooting that you will never practice. After you find a gun you like, practice practice practice. Practice what to do when it shoots and when it doesn't. Take a class on defensive handgun shooting. Knowledge is power. A 45 you can't hit crap with isn't worth as much as a 22 you can hit a pimple on a gnat's arse with blindfolded. A 45 that misses, is still a miss. A 22 through the throat or nasal cavity is a fight stopper.

#45 - Posted by: on April 25, 2007 01:27 AM

Try an S&W Mod 60 or a Ruger SP101 in .357. Carry with the old FBI or Chicago load, the .38 +P 158 grain lead hollow point or the Remington medium velocity .357.
You'll need the stainless steel as the concealed carry guns get a lot of sweat, which causes rust.
Since most police have switched over to autoloaders civilians think they should also. Nothing could be further from the truth. Civilians don't take down crack houses. A fast reload is meaningless for the civilian, that loud noise on pulling the trigger is what is important, no matter how long since you've cleaned and inspected. Autoloaders are fashionable these days but there isn't much that beats the "five for sure" out of a stainless steel revolver.
BTW, an ankle holster has it's good points, too. Most of us sit a lot and a gun in an ankle holster is handy while sitting. Handy in the car, too. Ever try to pull a gun from a waist holster while belted in the car? All of a sudden that ankle holster looks good.

#46 - Posted by: Peter on April 25, 2007 02:25 AM

1911, XD45 That's what I prefer, but a little too big to carry on your ankle. Even a snub nose 38 revolver is really too big (I have a 2" Taurus). For the ankle, you'll need to go with something small, and probably automatic. That's outside my sphere of knowledge. I've heard good and bad about kel-tec, but they have good support and user websites. (I have a SU-16C). Good luck.

#47 - Posted by: Andrew C on April 25, 2007 07:04 AM

I recomend the XD45, Compact or full size with a 4" barrel. With a good tuckable IWB holster you can wear the compact under a dress shirt no problem. Its a great shooting gun. I have personally put around 3000 rounds through mine and have yet to have one malfunction. It is DAO with a grip and trigger safety, so you have to want it to shoot before it will. All this with 11 to 14 rounds of .45 ACP makes it an unbeatable package in my book.

#48 - Posted by: Jason N on April 25, 2007 09:12 AM

I carry a Kimber Pro Raptor II in a Galco SkyOps IWB holster on a daily basis. Forget the ankle holster. Those seem only to be useful if you are already curled up in a ball on the ground, which is not a good place to start fighting from. The XD is an excellent handgun, but the .45ACP model is just too bulky for good concealment.

OH, and no one ever speaks to magazines. If you get a 1911, no matter what model, get Chip McCormick Corp. POWER MAGS. They are HANDS DOWN the best 1911 mag on the market. Just go to an IPSC or IDPA match, 8 of 10 shooters will be using CMC mags, you can bet on it.

Jason N:
The XD is not DAO. Glocks are DAO, because the striker is pre-cocked and the trigger pull fully cocks and releases the striker. In the SA XD, the striker is fully cocked, and the trigger pull disengages the sear which releases the fully cocked striker. That is why the XD cannot compete in USPSA production matches, because it is a single action gun.

#49 - Posted by: MaDeuceGunner on April 25, 2007 09:35 AM

Oh, and get some Remington Golden Sabers, no matter what caliber you buy. Great bullets.

#50 - Posted by: Ma Deuce Gunner on April 25, 2007 09:41 AM

Barrett .50 Cal. You can hide it in your golf bag. Since you wear a suit all the time you must play golf. You don't even have to shoot it. Just getting it out will discourage your opponent.
Seriously, any small revolver or auto-loader will do. You aren't really planning on a shoot-out. I carry a Firestar .45 cal because I travel outside of cities a lot and want the stopping power.
For concealed carry, Dillon Precision (http://dillonprecision.com)has a wide variety of hide-away holsters, including ones that double as briefcases or calendars.

#51 - Posted by: Old_dawg on April 25, 2007 10:26 AM

Go for the Springfield XD .45, or the Springfield 1911 GI Commander model. the 1911 Commander is the same 1911 .45 ACP that America knows and loves, just with an inch shorter barrel. That and some Federal Hydrashok ammunition will provide you all the stopping power you need to turn a would-be attacker inside out.

#52 - Posted by: Lt Warren on April 25, 2007 11:41 AM

The bottom line is you need to try different styles and see what works for you. There are small like the Kel-Tec and large like the Ruger and in-between like a Glock 19. I depends on how it fits on your body and works.

There are a wide variety of tuckable holsters. Don't forget about the belly band style too Under a dress shirt and worn on the weak (sidecrossdraw) is a nice option. Again, its about how you dress, how it feels, and how it shoots.

I prefer the Glock mechanism over a DAO style (like the Kel-Tec) or the SA style like the 1911. It is always ready to shoot and there is no safety to deal with.

Again, go to some shows, check out the various sizes and actions, and be safe.

#53 - Posted by: PartJew on April 25, 2007 11:50 AM

I'd like to remind people that they dropped two 500lbs on Zarkman and he lived for two hours. Puts the "stopping power" arguement in perspective.

The three most important things are.
1. Get something you WILL carry. The best gun left home is useless.
2. Get something you WILL shoot alot. That means something with cheap ammo, and something that doesn't hurt when you shoot.
3. Get something that is reliable. I like wheelguns for the foolproof'dness.

I would recommend a Smith & Wesson J-Frame .38+P with a crimson trace LG305 laser grip. Something like a model 637 (or the shrouded hammer or hammerless versions) http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14762&langId=-1&isFirearm=Y

Small enough to carry in your pocket. The laser makes it plenty accurate at short range, simple, safe, relatively cheap ammo - and utterly dependable. No stovepipes, misfeeds, jams, ever.


#54 - Posted by: Al on April 25, 2007 12:22 PM

MN does not have CCW, they have a permit to cary, that is different, you can not cary without it, but you can openly cary. I know, I have one. It took me a day to get it, probably because I have a permit to purchase too. I have a Beretta 92 (M-9), it is pretty easy to get parts and fix anything on it or replace it, but not very concealable. I like the CZ 75, and the SD-9 is amazingly accurate and smaller. whatever fits your hand, feels comfortable, and will be affordable enough for you to train regularly with it.

#55 - Posted by: on April 25, 2007 01:42 PM

I have actually looked into this issue in detail myself a couple times; most recently a month ago.
There is one big question you have to ask yourself first: which is more important: concealment (i.e. size) or stopping power. If you want something small enough to conceal easily, it will be hard to have a large caliber such as a .357 or .40SW. As others have said, you need someting you are comfortable carrying and shooting or you will leave it home. If you expect to use it at point blank range, then I personally do not think the caliber makes that much difference. If the muzzle is touching the bad guy when you pull the trigger, or is only a few inches away, you are going to hit him. I have three guns which are suitable for CCW: a .40 SW HK USP which is a great gun, but too large for carrying under normal dress clothes (I am a lawyer too). I have the HK in my nightstand, loaded with Remington Golden Sabres. The HK has a good safety and can be carried "cocked and locked" if desired. The second gun is a Beretta .32ACP Tomcat. It is a semi-auto that holds a seven round clip. It fits in the palm of my hand and could easily be concealed in an inside the pants holster. There are not a lot of choices for ammo for this one, but I have some Corbon bullets which work well. It has a thumb safety on the left side. A few weeks ago I bought the third gun. I wanted something even more concealable than the Beretta. I looked at dierringers. There are quite a few on the market, but some of them have reliability problems. Some are made in ridiculous calibers. One website I found had discussion about a dierringer in .44 magnum. The owner said he shot it once and had to make an appointment with an orthopedic surgeon for his wrist. Most dierringers hold two rounds. After looking at all the options I ended up buying a North American Arms revolver in .22 magnum. It holds five rounds. It is only about three inches long and two inches high. It has a safety feature which is unusual. In between the chambers it has notches in the end of the cylnder. The hammer is lowered into one of these notches, so it is not resting on a chambered round. I have only had a chance to fire it once, so far, but the kick is negligible. You have to pull the hammer back before you can pull the trigger--that is, it must be cocked first--you cannot fire it simply by pulling the trigger. In the catalog which came with the gun there is a holster which looks like a wallet. You can put the gun in the holster, put it in your pocket and it looks like you are carrying a wallet. I have not had time to try it out at the range, but I doubt it would be that accurate at more than 5-10 feet. However, if the mugger is at arm's length, it would be hard to miss him. The North American Arms website also shows the same gun with a form of built-in holster. The holster replaces the handle of the gun and has a clip you can put over your belt. My local gun dealeer said they do not make that model anymore, but you might be able to buy the holster clip part and retro-fit the gun. Hope this helps!

#56 - Posted by: fishlaw on April 25, 2007 02:23 PM

Nostalsia = 45 ACP
Accuacy = 9 MM ( Baretta )
Boom = .50 cal Desert Eagle
Illegal .50 cal machine gun

#57 - Posted by: will.see on April 25, 2007 05:10 PM

My spelling sucks. Sorry.

#58 - Posted by: will.see on April 25, 2007 05:12 PM

The company appears to be out of business, but I'm sure you could find some of these: The Mateba Autorevolver, aka Mateba Model 6 Unica. It has quite a lot of stopping power as I understand it, though it only shoots six bullets at a time; so you'd want to have a speed-loader on hand.

#59 - Posted by: Luipaard on April 25, 2007 06:25 PM

H&K .40 USP compact. Although I'm not sure how well it would work in an ankle holster, never having used one myself. I prefer not to have to bend over in front of my muggers. Prison changes a man, and I don't trust the rehabilitated.

#60 - Posted by: OtherChris on April 26, 2007 06:05 PM

For concealed carry I have a Taurus 2 inch 357, a Kahr K9 9mm, a Keltec P3AT in 380, and a Colt Mustang. While the 380s are not my first choice in a defensive handgun, the 357 and 9mm require that I wear a jacket or a Pager Pal type holster to conceal. That works in winter, but summer in Phoenix normally requires the wearing of shorts when working outdoors. The 380s fit easily in my short pockets and the Keltec has a polymer frame with a hard chrome slide. It's thin and flat while holding as much firepower as a 6 shot 38 special snubby. It's action is very similar to a Glock in deployment. It has not external safeties, but the hammer doesn't fall unless the trigger is pulled. I'd carry the Keltec as a backup piece, but when I can't carry a larger gun, the Keltec works. As one gun writer put it, the first rule of being in a gun fight is to bring a gun.

#61 - Posted by: FrmrArtyOffcr on April 26, 2007 10:07 PM

NO ankle holster if you interact with small children. They are often a LOT closer to your gun than you think. Once they discover it (think leg-hug) you have a problem.

That, and you are TOO FAR away for practical use.

An ankle holster (now an ankle WEIGHT) will effect your everyday stride. No one wants to limp to cover to get their gun out. Ok - your gun isn’t going to be 8 lbs… but it will probably throw off your stride and reveal itself that way. “Hey Tom, why are you limping?”

When choosing your holster, one point many people fail to consider : The Men’s Room. What will your holster do when it’s time for a twoosie in a public restroom ? You know the kind with open-bottom stall walls so the guy in the next stall can see/grab your gun as it lies exposed by your ankle - regardless of ankle holster, paddle, inside the waist band…etc.

There are a plethora of different concealment choices, and I would suggest you try several for different situations/modes of dress and occasions.

WHAT to carry is a choice that will change based on situation and expected range of threats… Others here have plenty of advice and I won’t get into that. I just wanted to share some thoughts on HOW to carry. Keep it close, keep it discrete, keep it comfortable (or you’ll leave it home more than not), keep it realistic.

Only thing I’ll say on WHAT to carry is DO NOT make it your family heirloom that grandpa carried as a cop or soldier or whathaveyou. If you USE the gun, it will be confiscated by police as potential evidence. Do you trust them to take the best care of it while it’s in their possession ? That super-looking highly polished piece may come back marred or dinged. or really beat-up - or not at all. What you carry should be a tool - not a treasure.

If the gun is taken by an LEO - insist on a receipt and a certificate of non-destruct (verbiage may vary depending). Some police agencies will routinely destroy a firearm after it’s use in a court case.

Remember : A concealed carry license is NOT a license to USE the gun. If you do have to use it - you will have to justify that use later in court. The gun is ALWAYS considered a DEADLY WEAPON. There IS NO “Shoot to wound” - only a lousy shot intended to kill. If you use it - that will be the assumption. Make sure you know what your state has to say about the use of deadly force. I know, I know “better to be tried by twelve than carried by six”… I’m just setting the proper expectations for you.

One last thought : CLEAR the gun of all ammo (magazine AND chamber) and practice drawing from concealment. If it’s clumsy, work out a technique or choose a different method of carry. Then practice some more. You may drop the gun a few times so do this on thick carpet at first - but DO practice - and do it with an EMPTY gun.

#62 - Posted by: Realist on April 27, 2007 05:28 AM

hey man, for a little gun in an ankle holster, the Kel Tek p32 is top notch. small and light, extremely easy to conceal.

that being said, i'd use that as a backup weapon, and go for something a little bigger that you can keep at the waist.

#63 - Posted by: Patriot Xeno on April 30, 2007 07:09 PM
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