Frank on Science!: Evolution

Evolution has been a problem with layman. First you have those with religious objections to it who declare it false but don’t really understand. Then you have those accepting of Science! and declare it true… and don’t really understand. I mean we keep explaining natural selection and mutations, but everyone keeps getting it in their head that evolution works the way Lamarck described it. Frankly, evolution is so complicated I don’t even know why we even bothered telling it to laymen. Darwin should have just kept it to himself and the immediate scientific community to keep everyone from getting their stupid all over it. I wish we’d do that with more Science!. The average man doesn’t need to know the earth goes around the sun; we should just keep stuff like that to ourselves.

But I digress. Anyway, instead of trying to explain evolution to you just so you cannot understand it, I’m going to explain just the most fundamental part of evolution: Why it proves that God didn’t create life.

As I said, evolution is very complicated. DNA, changing habitats, billions of years — a lot to comprehend. By analyzing the Bible, though, we can get a basic idea of God’s intelligence level, and the only conclusion Science! can make is that evolution is far too complicated for God to have done. God has demonstrated pretty much no advanced scientific knowledge, so it’s just unfathomable He would have had anything to do with evolution. If man were made from sculpting clay, then it’s believable God made us, but we just don’t see how He could have kept up with all the genetic changes to make man from a paramecium. And it doesn’t stop there. To even get to the conditions of having an earth on which life would form, God would have to have started His plan at the Big Bang fourteen billion years ago knowing exactly how an incalculable number of particles would form to eventually lead to now. That would take omniscience and some sort of infinite intelligence, something so ridiculous that you’ll have to excuse me while I laugh at the very notion.

Ha ho hee har ho ha hee!

By the way, based upon the intelligence level of Allah gather by analyzing the Koran, it would only be believable he made life if we were all made out of Legos.

Science!

UPDATE:

Oh, I see everyone has their own clever little saying they think disproves evolution. Poor foolish scientists spending time analyzing DNA and fossils when they could have just saved all that time and came up with a clever little saying.

“Scientists say that according to gravity everything is attracted to everything else. That means they’re trying to say I’m attracted to men! Gravity isn’t real Science! and just something moron scientists made up to prove everyone is homosexual!”

Thank you, laymen; please explain to us scientists what Science! is. We’re reeeeealy interested.

Science!

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66 Comments

  1. Watch it, Frankie. If you ain’t careful, that crazy God of ours will strike you down with an army made out of bones.

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  2. Actually according to the Koran we are made out of Blood clots. Which I suppose are the Legos of the seventh century.

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  3. everything is too complex and wonderful to be made by someone, thus it just happened by chance. It follows that lesser things (like this blog) just might write themselves by chance ..or possibly monkeys do it.

    [There is no such thing as “chance.” Every effect has a cause. It wasn’t chance that made everything. It was… Science! -Ed.]

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  4. I know everything there is about evolution. I’ve seen all three X-Men movies at least twice.

    The Koran also says that allah wraps flesh around bone during gestation. In fact the flesh forms first, bones develop later. So we’re left to accept one of two things; either the Almighty had his notes wrong on how a baby forms in the womb or Islam is a collosal hoax and Muhammad is so full of shit it backs up into his turban.

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  5. Oops, sorry, I said the S word in my post, forgot the PG-13 thing. You can take that out or replace it with crap if you want. I replace all sorts of things with crap.

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  6. Science! debunker.

    If science! were true, those in Africa would be ahead of us on the food chain, becaus ethey have had a 2 -4 million year head start. According to scientologists, Africa was not part of the last ice age, therefore the inhabitants should have keep progressing while the rest of us froze. By science! standards then, we can blame global warming on Africa and evolution. So we should send algore there to scold the Africans and tell them to quit breathing in the name of science! So if scientologists! say that aids is Gods ways of stopping evolution, why isn’t evolution so much more powerful to stop it? I guess evolution is racists against black people.

    That makes science! racist!

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  7. that’s great to connect this post to a dianetics ad.

    I got a Florida Tech University Online ad. What do they teach at FTU? Science!

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  8. “instead of trying to explain evolution to you just so you cannot understand it, I’m going to explain just the most fundamental part of evolution: Why it proves that God didn’t create life.”

    Is this just a complicate way of saying “the debate is over”? Stand back sports fans, as Frank J., ably assisted by Science!, proves a negative. A feat never before witnessed by men or paramecia!

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  9. I’ve always understood evolution.

    1. Something happened.
    2. Here we are today!

    That’s about all there is to it.

    The other part about evolution you have to understand is called “Affirming the Consequent.” It works like this.

    A. If evolution is true, then life would be on earth as it is today. (Regardless of *what* evolution is, all evolutionists agree with this.)
    B. There is life on earth as it is today.
    C. Therefore, evolution is true!

    Logic!

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  10. You’d rather me believe nothing became something, then it became something else, the eventually a rock, then a tree…, then me? Yeah, right.
    In the beginning God created the Heavens and the Earth… BIG BANG! …nuff said.
    Now, on evolution in and of itself, nothing unBiblical about it. God didn’t create the Xerox machine. That all things interact and change due to enviroment and such, thats plain common sense… no news here. One might say that it was God that created evolution… read the Bible. Start at page 1. It’s all in there.

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  11. Unfortunately, ‘evolution’ does not explain DNA, all of which is a copy of it’s ancestors. Which means that there had to be an original, created set. Feel free to prove that concept wrong…

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  12. So Big Al, since “all things interact and change due to enviroment and such,” when you go sit in the woods do you become a tree squirrel?

    No, evolution ain’t in the Bible. Or did you forget, “On the first day…” and “on the second day…” , etc.? By the end of the first week all things were created, not evolved. You might want to read past page 1. Just sayin.

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  13. “God didn’t create the Xerox machine” I knew I would learn something if I just read far enough down the comment thread.

    now what about when people sit on the Xerox machine? Is that proof of evolution?

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  14. darwins evolution is mythical. he struggled his whole life to try and fill in the gaps in the fossil record and prove gradual change over millions of years, but it never happened. even today the fossil record doesn’t show gradual change. the current best theory is “punctuated equilibrium” short bursts of rapid change over thousands of years not millions upon millions. and missing that short term, rapid change.

    as if the universe is a giant machine with a method for correcting errors. you can’t correct errors by making tiny changes over huge amounts of time or no two animals would be even close to each other. darwin was wrong and the real solution to evolution ends up being more in line with logic rather than chance.

    and don’t look at the bibles creation story as false simply because the universe is billions of years older than humans, and so the 6 days are myth. i look at it as if god showed 6 scenes to the writer of the first 5 books and he interpreted them as days. remember that millions didn’t really exist let alone billions and humans do show up last eg. extremely late on the scene say perhaps…… scene 6.

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  15. God wins Time Magazine’s Diety of the year……….again.

    Name: God.

    Nickname(s): “Lord Almighty”, “Big Kahuna”, “Jesus’s Dad”, “The Anti-Satan”, “All Powerful Guy Who Could Make Our Lives Miserable if He Doesn’t Have a Good Sense of Humor”, “Tsunami-Obsessed Megalomaniac.”
    Claim to Fame: Once dated Mother Nature, now they’re just friends; Gave fame to John Travolta, then took it away, then gave it back, now regrets the whole thing.
    Hobbies: Judging people; Complacency; Playing with Earth’s tectonic plates near underdeveloped countries that have little or no weather-reporting skills.
    Pros: Family oriented, extremely wealthy, ability to grant wishes disguised as prayers; forgives sins.
    Cons: Translucent; Somewhat intimidating before you get to know him; Always knows when you’re lying; Power hungry; Moody; May flood Earth if pissed off.
    Turnons: Generosity, kindness, South Park.
    Turnoffs: Breaking 10 Commandments; Taking name in vain; Sports-related prayers; George Clooney movies.
    Favorite invention(s): Volcanoes; Ability of insects to walk upside down; Boobs.
    Least Favorite invention(s): lice, butt crack hair, the French, Democrats; Muslims.
    Recent Quote: “If I knew then what I know now, I would have never given them opposable thumbs.

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  16. Perhaps if there were more references to protein chemistry, quantum chromodynamics and tectonic plates in the Bible, Science! would conclude differently, Frank.

    So… What DOES God need with a Starship Universe?

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  17. why do people keep gerbils and stuff. its fun to watch them run on the wheel. that’s why god needs a universe.

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  18. In all reality, nothing should exist. Not even a vacuum of space. But it does. Beat me up with Science! and tell me how all this stuff got here. You can keep it in your scientific! references as I am pretty sharp and will understand. The Scientist! I have heard from say that the Universe at one time was as small as a pea. But then it got super hot and exploded. Why did it get super hot if it was floating in a non existant universe. Is a complete lack of everthing hot? Basically what you are saying is nothing “evolved” into something. Any scientist! making that claim and worth his salt should be able to explain that. What was the size of the universe before it was the size of a pea? Is the size of a BB just not hot enough to explode and create a universe? It seems to me that if it was smaller then it would be hotter because it is more compressed. So was the universe really big and then it compressed so much it got hot and exploded? It seems like that would have to be the case. All of these Scientist! do say it was compressed. That would indicate that the universe started out large. As for all the other trivial stuff like time and nuclear fission you can just pull up the white paper you wrote explaining those. What are the properties of light? Why does it travel at 186,000 miles a second and not a million miles a second. If there is nothing in space to stop it, why the limitation. If you could just please answer these questions mankind would no longer need laws. We could just kill off all the losers on the planet and have it all to ourselves. No need for goodness if God doesn’t exist.

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  19. @zzyzx
    Hilarious, not sure if the levity line comes in but i sure got a kick out of it. Really I think it makes more fun of us and the false or shortsighted ways we try and frame and define him when communicating to each other.

    Wasn’t the sun created on like the third day? So right there clearly days weren’t what we conventionally think of them. Think of the word gay and how many times its changed meanings in 1 lifetime. Or think of Eskimos and their many words for “snow” or the french and their many different words for “surrender” and “no you look and smell like a douche-bag”. Anyway for what is likely a 5k yr old text and has been through so many languages I find it a miracle we can read it at all. But I try not to get hung up on any one word that may have originally had a different connotation then 2009 American English understands it.

    (Having lived around eskimos the snow thing is actually more a myth, but it is an accurate concept )

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  20. This is old news. I mean, you posted this yesterday, Frank. But what about making Eve from Adams rib? That’s still as true today as it was yesterday, isn’t it? Oops, I meant “as true today as it was day before yesterday”.

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  21. Scientist have recently noticed that the increase in polar bear population is coincident with a decrease in the Eskimo population. Initial studies indicate that polar bears have “evolved” a taste for Eskimos.

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  22. @tfonate:

    You said, “and don’t look at the bibles creation story as false simply because the universe is billions of years older than humans, and so the 6 days are myth. i look at it as if god showed 6 scenes to the writer of the first 5 books and he interpreted them as days. remember that millions didn’t really exist let alone billions and humans do show up last eg. extremely late on the scene say perhaps…… scene 6.

    Uh, sorry, you don’t get to pick and choose which parts of the Bible are ‘true’ and which are not. What can be more clear than , “And there was evening and morning, the first day;” “And there was evening and morning, the second day, etc?” How else can one ‘interpret’ this language other than single 24-hour periods without being blatantly intellectually dishonest?

    Sorry, that boat don’t float. It, too, is a ‘myth.’

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  23. Repeat after me, very slowly: random mutation, in an interaction with a biological niche, will select among the members of a particular species those individuals best able to prosper in that niche.
    This is called microevolution. Sometimes it happens in nature, as with Darwin’s finches. Sometimes it is done by people, as with the selective breeding of domestic animals.
    On the other hand, there is no mechanism which has ever been produced which will produce a new bone, a new chamber for a heart, a new limb, or a new organ. Were such a mechanism to exist, humans would have used it long ago. This is called macroevolution, and macroevolution does not exist has never been demonstrated.
    About the best that can be done is forcing two genotypes together, as has been done with domestic wheat, domestic cotton, and domestic corn, and the magnificent F1 hybridization of various crop species. Such activities begin with existing life forms, and do not create from nothing.

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  24. Evolution doesn’t explain Obama supporters, the an existance of a God can’t explain them either. Maybe De-Evolution can explain Obama supporters.

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  25. It isn’t necessarily intellectual dishonesty. You have to take a few things into account when attempting to read the bible. Firstly, it has been translated, then translated again, then the language changed a bit, then it was translated, and finally we have the English version. It is actually within the realm of possibility that the “days” described in Genesis is a mistranslation for some other increment of time that the cultures writing or orally retelling this didn’t understand.

    Other things can also mess with our understanding of the bible today that God doesn’t fix for what could be any number of reasons.

    It also possible that the bible story is 100% accurate and the evidence of what we think today was just left there to mess with us. Just sayin’

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  26. “And there was evening and morning, the first day;” “And there was evening and morning, the second day, etc?” How else can one ‘interpret’ this language other than single 24-hour periods without being blatantly intellectually dishonest?”

    Umm, how about the writer being exposed to the fantastic scenes of Creation and attempting to explain them in their own words using only concepts available to them at that time?

    Could not the “evening and morning, first day” be the way the writer conveys a passage of time, followed by a pause?

    Revelations is another obvious book where the writer is clearly struggling to pass along information with a lack of understanding and technical background.

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  27. Typical uneducated scientist babbling about what he doesn’t understand – what the Bible does and doesn’t say. Study Genesis with an eye to the original Hebrew and you will be very surprised that it’s nothing what your atheist teachers (ok, or probably your Sunday school teachers) told you about. The Bible, in it’s different versions, is a translation and collection of holy scripture, not holy unto itself. Genesis might be talking about literal days or figurative days. The Hebrew implies a 24 hour day, but that’s not a definitive answer.

    Amazing the amount of hard science that has to be ignored for evolution to be believed. I never understood why my mathematician and physicist friends called biology a “soft science” until I took all those biology and anthropology courses. Wow, what a load of self-aggrandizing folks who have no clue. On the opposite, quantum mechanics supports intelligent design, and vice versa.

    Evolution takes more faith than I have. The core issue is really random chance vs. design. Remember, first there was nothing, and then it exploded… But, I digress. It’s hard to get through to some people.

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  28. It is the glory of God to conceal a thing, and the honor of kings to discover it.

    That’s in one of the old testament books that starts with an ‘E’ but I forget which one. I like the sentiment, though.

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  29. See, the thing with evolution is that you have extremists at both ends: on one side there’s the people who think that anyone who doesn’t believe in evolution is a total idiot, and on the other side you have people who think that anyone who believes in evolution (or even acknowledges its possibility) is a Jesus-hating atheist that wants to destroy America.

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  30. Science!’s certainty is in inverse proportion to our ability to verify its claims.

    Public – What happened to the dinosaurs?
    Science – A big old asteroid wiped’em out! Absolutely fer sure!
    Public – Is it going to rain tomorrow?
    Science – Heck, I don’t know – maybe. Ask me again in the morning.
    Public – How did life begin?
    Science – Natural selection caused inorganic compounds to create complex chains of replicating molecules which grew and developed interactive structures that replicated all major life functions like injestion, excretion, respiration, locomotion, and reproduction – all within a microscopic blob smaller than a speck of dust while floating in a hot, wildly agitated ocean boiled by volcanic erruptions, thrashed by metor and lightning strikes – which then became dinosaurs.
    Public – What did you have for lunch yesterday?
    Science – Um, let me see… was it the salad? Let me check the stains on my labcoat.

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  31. The problem with the THEORY of evolution is that it is being debunked daily by Science! But the masses have been convinced that we are the result of a primordial ooze… I’ll stick with God creating everything. It takes less faith!

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  32. “And there was evening and morning, the first day;” “And there was evening and morning, the second day, etc?” How else can one ‘interpret’ this language other than single 24-hour periods without being blatantly intellectually dishonest?

    “Day” and “night” were not divided until the fourth day (Genesis 1:14, 19). For the first three days there was no day and night as we know it – there was no meaning to earth rotating on its axis. There was no sun to orbit around to produce seasons and years; there were no moons or stars; there was no cosmology whatsoever! Y’all have fun figuring out what “day” means under a system like that.

    And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years…And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.”

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  33. Science! loves evolution Evolution. Science! also worships entropy. You can’t have both simultaneously, not for what it would take to evolve what we have. So which is it: entropy or evolution?

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  34. Since this blog was created (during the Dot Com Big Bang), I’ve noticed it evolving. Once and a while, there’s a paradigm shift and people even comment on weekends!

    But no one has addressed my question, however.

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  35. You know, I just don’t understand how millions of organic compounds, tens of thousands of proteins and enzymes and all those hormones can get ‘er done. Life itself – let alone reproduction – boggles my mind. God must be some kind of sex-driven chemist, or something.

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  36. On the other hand, the seemingly infinite nature of mathematics has me worried. For years, I’ve suspected he/she was a mathematician. But I just can’t explain how a mathematician would be so interested in chemistry – and sex.

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  37. The bible teaches all the important truths, not all the truths. The creation story in a bible, in my opinion, is a simplified version of what happened, so that all of Gods children, from savages to learned professor, can understand the central important thing, that God created everything. The exact details and time frame are unimportant to our salvation, only that God was at the center of it. To believe otherwise, is to be like a ignorant member of the Taliban, who believes that anything, like a skyscraper or a kite, that is not in his little book is against God and must be destroyed.

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  38. Also, I hold to the theory that in ancient Hebrew, the word for day can also be substituted for the word era. Such as how we might say in the Day of Herod, or in Caesars Day. Sometimes the words of the prophets don’t make the language jump, so we have to rely on guidance to sort this out.

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  39. I’m going to help you guys out on the day and night thing … or more accurately the night and day thing … an evening and a morning.

    Evenings are dark. Mornings are bright. The “evening and morning” expression well describes a period of developement.

    Say you get up really early and go on a road trip. Gradually things lighten up of develop from your vantage point. It’s an illustration. now don’t fall asleep at the wheel.

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  40. I love this thread! Great comments — especially #38: That’s pretty much how I remember my biology professor and his explanation for life on earth. And #26 has given me something to think about (not the part about killing off the losers; the other stuff.) I think ss396 (#41) gets my vote for explaining the problem of defining all the days of creation as 24 hr. periods.

    tfonate, as I understand punctuated equilibrium, it is an effort to explain away the lack of evidence for macroevolution in the fossil record — rather a problem for evolutionists since the fossil record was what they used to point to as proof of their theory.

    Both the writers and commenters on this site make it my favorite blog. You guys are great.

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  41. It takes less faith for me to believe God created us than it does to believe in evolution, especially considering there’s no proof and never will be.

    Could evolution be true and God-directed? Sure. There’s no proof for it but sure. I mean, just because someone might believe that God used evolution doesn’t mean your salvation’s at stake. (Of course, if you believe that evolution disproves God, that’s another matter.)
    But what’s the point of that? Why would God start with a big bang, puddles of slime, take billions of years, and create us through a series of random accidents? The Bible says we are created in God’s image. He communed with Adam and Eve in the garden, sent His Son to die for us. We are special.
    If evolution were true we’d be no different than bugs, dandelions, and poo-flinging monkey-faced liberals.

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  42. I read this in high school and it pretty much explains the whole Why-Evolution-Is-Crap thing.

    http://www.amazon.com/Did-Man-Just-Happen-Evolutionists/dp/B000QYH2WO/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1260740264&sr=8-6

    Also Frank, that whole Scientists! should keep everything from us so we don’t get our stupid on it didn’t work out so great for them with all that climate change stuff. In fact, I’m pretty sure that Science! came out looking stupid on that one.

    (I don’t know – do Scientists get the exclamation point? Damn you Blue Book of Grammer! How you fall short…)

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  43. Is this satire? Or is Frank going the Chuckie Johnson route of driving traffic to his site? I really don’t have time for another cyber flame war over matters of faith–which includes evolution and creationism.

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  44. I spent 35 years arguing how God would not have used evolution, but that the creation account described the big bang before science was around to expand on it. Then reread Genesis 1:20, 21 and had to call my children and say “Oops”. Kind of says there that every moving thing that has life had its origin from the waters. I hate it when I miss God’s great big hints. We still debate the origin of Adam.

    (We have no debate that he existed and was a chosen child of God.)

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  45. Dude. This is one of my favoritest websites. It is a must read ’cause you make me giggle like a little school girl, but if you’re gonna go all ‘Charles Johnson’ on us, I’m gonna delete you from my favorites and find somebody else to make me giggle.

    Evolution happens, on a micro-scale. SCIENCE! has proven that, but to suggest that life formed from the primordial sludge to progress to the pinnacle of where we are now by just chance, you no longer make me giggle. SCIENCE! as you are apt to phrase it answers questions, but there are some that, as yet, SCIENCE! cannot. What are quarks and leptons comprised of? What existed before the ‘big bang?’ What evolutionary process could possibly result in Al Gore, Bambi, and *shudder* Nancy ‘Buttcrust’ Pelosi? What did Michael Moore evolve from? A turd doesn’t evolve, at least not that I am aware. Janeane Garofalo. Please. Fromunda cheese has more personality and mine hasn’t shown much propensity of gaining sentience.

    The evolutionist and the creationist both have to rely on faith that their ‘religion’ is right and to denigrate one because the ideology the believer embraces makes no sense to others is wrong. When it is all over and we have all the answers, if I’m wrong, I’ll say “I was wrong.” to you and your ilk. And weep like a little school girl.

    If the opposite is the case, I hope you would do the same.

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  46. Sorry, 4of7, I’ve been gone. I really don’t know what God needs with a Universe. And if he created it, how come he did that? First, he has no Universe and then he decides he needs one? Something changed. Was he bored?

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  47. I’m just a layman (also being familiar with the sitting and standing positions) and I want to know if there is some easy way to get out from under the tyranny of Science! with it’s scientists .

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  48. Religion and Science! are the same thing. Both of them say “I know” when what they really mean is “I believe”.

    If you can say “The Science! Is Settled” then you are not a scientist.

    If there was a God, everybody who complained about Sarah Palin’s qualifications and then supported The Zero would have burst into flame.

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  49. Idahoser says:

    December 15th, 2009 at 11:58 am
    Religion and Science! are the same thing. Both of them say “I know” when what they really mean is “I believe”.
    If you can say “The Science! Is Settled” then you are not a scientist.
    If there was a God, everybody who complained about Sarah Palin’s qualifications and then supported The Zero would have burst into flame.

    Thank you Idahoser.
    All science can do is use the tools available to try to explain the observable natural world. Evolution says nothing about creation. The evolutionary biologist doesn’t care if the world was “created” by Jahweh, jehova, thor,allah, vishnu, the flying spaghetti monster, or joe shit the rag man…mostly because none of those are observable.

    Now, if your beliefs are so fragile that you need to have a literal translation of the bible to back them up, I think you need to actually reread the book (not just the good bits) , and decide which one of the creation timelines you believe (there are 2), then decide if you want to tie your cart to something that codones murder, slavery, genocide, infanticide………

    When I did so it gave me a stronger belief in a god that wants nothing to do with religion

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  50. “We say, not lightly but very literally, that the truth has made us free. They say that it makes us so free that it cannot be the truth.To them it is like believing in fairyland to believe in such freedom as we enjoy. It is like believing in men with wings to entertain the fancy of men with wills. It is like accepting a fable about a squirrel in conversation with a mountain to believe in a man who is free to ask or a God who is free to answer. This is a manly and a rational negation for which I for one shall always show respect. But I decline to show any respect for those who first of all clip the wings and cage the squirrel, rivet the chains and refuse the freedom, close all the doors of the cosmic prison on us with a clang of eternal iron, tell us that our emancipation is a dream and our dungeon a necessity; and then calmly turn round and tell us they have a freer thought and a more liberal theology.”
    – G.K. Chesterton, The Everlasting Man, (Part II, Chapter 5, The Escape From Paganism.)

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  51. Geez Frank, you had to know that posting an “evolution” post would summon the folks who believe that the answers to the earth, the universe and everything fit in a book you can put in your breast pocket. I assume you picked up that rock just for fun, to watch them scurry around in the bright piercing light of SCIENCE!

    But that’s not the sort of thing a sophisticated blogger would do. I’m surprised at you. Now they’re all stirred up again and might show up at my door again to explain to me how God created malaria and ebola because it was all part of the “big plan”. If they do, I’m sending them to your house.

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  52. I’m a liberal biology nerd that just stumbled on this blog, and i’m probably like a year too late, but… i totally get where you’re coming from! no one knows what started it all. i’m not saying that scientists shouldn’t try to find out, but shooting the idea the god could have started the big bang and the LUCA is really silly if nothing else can explain why this all happened.
    #16, dna might prove evolution, because of “junk dna”. some junk dna are called pseudogenes, and scientists believe that they are genes from before humans evolved that became so mutated that they don’t mean anything anymore.
    that’s what i read, at least.
    ok. i’m going to stop now, because i might be nerdy but i’m still a layman.

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