So, what to make of Rudy Giuliani? Well, one thing you can’t argue about is how effective he was as mayor, especially if you’re someone like me who knew both pre-Giuliani and post-Giuliani New York. That city was a mess under Dinkins and New Yorkers had accepted getting stabbed as just part of city life. Then Giuliani came in and cleaned up the place from the bottom up, once famously beating to death a group of panhandlers with a tire iron. Getting stabbed became so uncommon as to actually be newsworthy again.
Will Giuliani clean up terrorism like he did crime? I think so. They attacked his city while he was mayor, and he is very angry at them. You can tell by his eyes he wants nothing more than to personally hurt terrorists. If he ever saw a terrorist, you know he would knock the terrorist to the ground and stomp on him and hit him with whatever was at hand – probably a metal trashcan. In many way, this is exactly the sort of president we need.
But what about other issues that social conservatives like me care about? While he says he firmly supports legalized abortion, he claims he would have made the same judicial appointments as President Bush. If you believe him, then a lot of social conservatives could live with that. Then there’s his social life, and Republicans really don’t want to elect their own Clinton. How do we know he won’t embarrass us there, and how much do we care in a time of war?
Then there’s the issue that concerns both social conservatives and libertarians: Guns. When interviewed by Sean Hannity last night, he said he’s for states making their own laws but stuck by New York’s gun control laws saying they were appropriate for a densely populated area. In other words, he’s for gun rights except in places where you’re likely to need a gun for self-defense. That’s disturbing to me, because I see a stance on gun rights as an indicator of how someone views American freedom in general.
I trust Giuliani on the terrorists killing issue – the most important issue – but how many failings in other areas are allowed before a personal desire to step on terrorists’ necks is not enough? What do you think?
Killing terrorists is more important to me than pretty much any other issue. But in his H&C interview on FOXNews, he also said he was in favor of smaller government and lower taxes. Those two issues combined make me forgive any other shortcomings he may have.
Since my fellow Mongers have apparently gone on hiatus, I can go ahead and agree with your assessment of Giuliani.
To me he gets a score of zero. I like about as much about him as I dislike about him.
Ok–we leave abortion to the states and I live in the Peoples Republic of Minnesota so that doesn’t work for me. I also live in Minneapolis–does this qualify as one of the areas that the mayor would disarm? How far from the city can I live? I currently reside in a suburb 25 miles out–is this far enough or should I move out 100 miles before I can own a gun? No thanks, Rudy! The government needs to leave me the hell alone thank you!
He is not a conservative. Giuliani Gets an “A” on fighting terrorism, but an “D Minus” on guns. A “Free Nation” is not just guaranteed through our organized military. The Second Amendment cannot be brushed aside with promises of “the government will keep you safe.” Rudy gets an average of “C Plus” from me. But that is not that great. I do not trust him. I am in Minneapolis also, and I fear that Giuliani would be popular here despite his GOP moniker. That should tell you something.
Regarding Rudy:
NEXT!
I wouldn’t support him at the primary level.
If he were the nominee, I’d vote for him, but I don’t think I’d be walking precincts for him.
I don’t see a perfect Presidential candidate. Romney pussyfoots about his positions too often. McCain is a media whore. Both of them, I think, would have problems getting elected: Romney because he’s a Mormon and McCain because the press will suddenly “discover” that he’s seventy-two years old (in 2008) and has had two bouts with malignant melanoma. Giuliani is, I think, the only candidate who is both electable and serious about keeping the USA safe. He’s not my ideal candidate, but I wouldn’t have to hold my nose to vote for him, either.
In my view, I just want to win the damn war, and win the election. Giuliani may be the one to do it. Social issues? ..forgetaboutit…
You’ll never resolve the abortion debate anyway (why is there even an abortion debate with the “plan B” pill readily available?)
If you want a snapshot of Pre-Giuliani New York, try to catch the 1991 episode of SNL hosted by Joe Mantegna. Almost every bit was a slam on The Big Rotten Apple. This followed the the infamous Time magazine cover and a year that saw some 2200 murders.
The problem with Giuliani is that he’s a very hands-on politician, and when his desk is clear, he’ll find something to go after, like titty bars or nightlife in general. If you think getting a gun in NYC is hard, try getting a liquor license.
He also does not play well with others. He will be constantly butting heads with a Democratic Congress, and will remind them that “Veto” is his middle name. And if you thought The NY Times hated Bush…
Al Sharpton and former NYCLU head Norman Siegel are already working on their hit job against Rudy the Racist. Dummies that they are, this will only help Rudy in the primaries, who’s already leading among Republicans of every stripe (imagine – a politician who knows Sharpton for the racial arsonist he is, and will call him on it).
From crushing The Mob to governing an un-governable city to keeping us calm after 9/11, Giuliani’s legacy is that of a can-do guy. As long as there are big problems for him to work on (and who doubts there will be), the little things will take of themselves.
I’m resigned to the reality that we will be forced to choose a candidate from a pool of deeply flawed people I wouldn’t trust with my wife, kids, pets or checking account. but bunkerboy makes a good case for Rudy.
2008 is going to suck…
Rudy or McCain and I stay home on 11/4/08, and I mean that. You’ll get whomever the Dems put up for Pres and maybe another penis-in-the-mouth author like Webb in the Senate.
If I want a f(&(g Democrat, I will VOTE for one. I won’t vote for a Pseudo-Republican.
In that case Keith hail to Pres. Hillary for you.
Wow a conservative coward, thats new.
I am a Dem and I sure as hell dont want Hillary to be president now Bill is another matter Bill Clinton wet dream but anyways I will not be voting for any of the current batch of Dems so you can believe that my vote is going to either McCain or “the one that I want” RUDY.
If there are any other candidates that have the personal stake and capacity for violence that Rudy has, then I’ll look at them. But I’ll not trade the terrorist killin’ for nothin’. Hell, I’d vote Clinton if I was certain of its devotion to killing terrorists and making those that support terrorists fear us like some wrathful and capricious god of capricious wrath.
Thank you, Bunkerboy! All week long, since City Journal ran a column on Giuliani being conservative, I’ve been trying to remember who the guest was so I could find that show. (Alas, no transcript at the SNL transcript site.)
I remember that great skit where Kevin Nealon is interviewing Mantegna, who is playing a NYC tourism rep, on a call-in radio show. Mantegna and Nealon keep going on and on about how many Broadway shows you can see, while callers call in to report that they’ve just been robbed. A typical exchange:
Nealon: “I mean, where else can you see Cats and then eat at Original Ray’s? Hello, Caller?”
Caller: “Hi, I’ve just been stabbed. I was just waiting for the subway and another guy stuck a knife in me.”
Mantegna: “Well, did you make eye contact?”
Caller: “Yeah.”
(Mantegna rolls his eyes and gestures, “What’s the guy expect?” as only Mantegna can.)
Nealon: “I’m sure that’s just a small price to pay to live in a city where you can go ice skating in Central Park.”
Michael,
I was actually thinking of that SNL sketch as I wrote this. I loved the pamphlets he had for tourists.
“So You’ve Been Stabbed”
“So You’ve Been Shot”
“So You’ve Been Set on Fire and Thrown Off a Building”
“The I Love New York Guide to Not Making Eye Contact”
i have no doubt of rudy’s terrorist-killing instint, but i cant get over the fact that he would limit gun ownership in cities.
i live in chicago (north side) but everyone knows how bad the south side gets, and that blame I place on Chicago’s gun ban.
overall, rudy’s got a lot going for him, but his gun control views would lose my vote
I’m not sold on Giuliani for all the familiar reasons. While we’re dicking around teaching our party a lesson from 08 to 2012 Al Qaeda is going to be planning more attacks, Iran is going to developing the bomb, and we’re going to risk selling out Iraq.
Whatever problems there are (and there are problems) with our guys–you show me a Dem who’s serious about dealing with all this, and I’ll consider ignoring the Republican. Barring that, if we want to keep Giuliani from being President, take care of it during the primaries. If he does win, we can’t afford to screw around during the next pres. election.
Bell…good points! Anyone williing to leave anything to the government is going to get service from the same guys that handled Katrina! And liberals are surprised when the government screws up…if we just spent MORE money! But…after Bush gets done being a dickweed for the next 2 years, Herself is going to be elected anyway and it won’t matter! Ronald Reagan said “Communism only works in Heaven where they don’t need it and in Hell where they already have it”…but Hillary still believes in it and so will you after she is coronated!
I’m not too worried about the government taking away my gun. If they try, well, I’ve got a gun. :/
Rudy is a conservative at heart. He just said he is for gays and gun control to pay lip service to the silly NYers. This man is a killer and nothing more pleases him than a dead terrorist (i.e Jihadist).
If he can stop the squigee men in NYC, he can solve the radical isalmists.
No guns for NY because of NYC? =population density= ??!
That sounds very New-Orleans-after Katrina-like, where the officials took the guns exactly WHEN they were most needed by their law abiding owners.
In NYC, Washington DC, Chicago, Detriot and so many other places WHERE you’re more likely than other places to cross the criminal element and need your gun(s), you can’t have them.
In safer places or at safer times and in non-NY states, Rudiani’s OK with us excercising our constitutional right to bear arms, but not otherwise. Fantastic. Might sound like a federalist or states-rights kind of spin on the problem, but that’s not applicable. The Second Amendment’s right to bear arms is not meant to be conditional to local/state governments’ local whims.
Nonwithstanding the 2nd itself, Rudiani’s position is selfevidently dumb. You need your guns more in such places, not less. Gah! This is unserious stuff. But he looks better than a lot of the candidates mucking about, nonetheless, and -that= is a downer.
Rudy…not in the primaries, but if he is my choice against any of the Demos, I’ll vote for Rudy.
Well, Rudy is no John McCain or Hillary Clinton.
And that’s why I’ll vote for Rudy–if I get the chance.
Isn’t there anyone else???
Yuck, I smell RINO poop.